Episode 40: From surgery every 5 years to reclaiming her body
Winsome was 13 when she was first put on the pill for debilitating period pain.
By 16, she'd been diagnosed with endometriosis, had her first laparoscopy, and began what felt like an inevitable cycle: surgery, temporary relief, pain returns, repeat.
The diagnosis brought validation – finally, a reason for her suffering that people understood.
But years later, facing her third surgery with the same gynecologist telling her this would be her reality forever, something shifted.
"I thought, well, no. That can't be my life. That's not living."
In this honest conversation with Dr Peta Wright and physiotherapist Paula Hindle, Winsome shares her journey from feeling dismissed and powerless to discovering a completely different approach to pelvic pain.
One that honoured her whole body, her nervous system, her story, and her power to heal.
This episode isn't about rejecting medicine or claiming there's only one right way to heal. It's about what becomes possible when we listen to the body, tend to the nervous system, and ask what pain might be communicating beneath the surface.
In this episode, we explore:
Why Winsome felt relief when she was diagnosed with endometriosis – and what that reveals about how we validate women's pain
What happened in her first appointment at Vera – and why the experience felt completely different from any healthcare she'd received before
The first time Winsome actually felt her pelvic floor – and why it was both painful and empowering
How Winsome learned to listen to pain as communication rather than seeing it as "my pain" that would never leave
The heroine's journey: why you have to be ready for this work, and what keeps her committed even when it's hard
What practitioners need to know about creating truly trauma-informed, holistic care from start to finish
For women navigating pelvic pain:
If Winsome's story resonates, you might be ready to explore a different approach to healing – one that treats the whole woman, not just the symptoms.
Our Heal Your Pelvic Pain program is a comprehensive 10-week online course led by Dr Peta Wright, Dr Thea Bowler, and Paula Hindle. It's an experiential, embodied approach that helps you understand your nervous system, reconnect with your body, and reclaim your power.
Learn more about Heal Your Pelvic Pain here.
For practitioners:
If you're craving a more grounded, nervous-system-led approach to pelvic pain care – one that supports your patients without burning you out – join us for Transformational Medicine: Alchemising Pain into Power.
This isn't just about learning new techniques. It's about your own embodiment, regulation, and transformation – because you can't hold space for healing if you're disconnected from your own body.
Two pathways available in 2026:
4-day in-person immersive retreat (17–20 April 2026)
12-week online program (starts 4 May 2026)
Episode transcript
[00:00:00] Welcome to Women of the Well. This is a podcast to help you heal, learn, and feel empowered to take back your body and your healthcare. Hosted by Gynecologists, Dr. Peta Wright, Dr. Thea Bowler, and holistic counselor, Sam Lindsay German. This is for women who want to remember the magic, beauty, and power in their bodies to live a healthy life that's true to themselves.
This podcast is for information and educational purposes only, and is not intended as a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Before we start today's episode, we would like to acknowledge and show our deep respect to the Jiniburra people as the traditional custodians of the beautiful land we are recording this on.
We pay respect to their elders past, present, and across time, and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples today. Now it's time to replenish yourself by the [00:01:00] well.
Today's conversation isn't about rejecting medicine or claiming a single right way to heal. It's about listening to the body, the nervous system, and what pain might be asking for beneath the surface. Pelvic pain is complex and many people do everything they're told, tests, scans, treatments, and yet still feel stuck, dismissed, or disconnected from their bodies.
Today I am joined by beautiful Winsome who has lived with persistent pelvic pain. I'm also joined by Paula, our beautiful Physio, and Winsome found healing through potentially different way than what we're taught, in an approach that centers safety, nervous system, regulation, and reconnection rather than just symptom suppression.
So her story isn't prescriptive. It's an invitation to curiosity, compassion, and perhaps a different way of understanding pain. So welcome ladies.
Thank you very much , happy to be here.
Winsome, can you tell us a little bit about, [00:02:00] about you, about your story? So what. Brought you to see a doctor in the first place.
What were, what was your pelvic pain like? At its worst? Mm-hmm. I came to see a doctor for the first time for my pelvic pain when I was probably 13. Mm-hmm. And that was because every period was so intensely painful. I couldn't go to school, I couldn't go to my dance classes, and I couldn't participate in my life and went to the doctor and put on.
So I was on the pill from age 13 until probably 24, 25. And how old are you now? I'm 28. Okay. Yeah. And that was the, the first kind of treatment for my pelvic pain. And it was just to stop having periods. Mm-hmm. And that worked for a time, but then the pain still came back and it wouldn't matter if I was menstruating or not, I would feel pain.
Um. [00:03:00] I then went to a gynecologist and they diagnosed me with endometriosis through a laparoscopic surgery when they also inserted a marina. And that was when I was 16, so I was still at school. It was my first week of year 12. I remember that. Yeah. And from then I continued working with that gynecologist.
She, um. I was really lovely and kind, but she had a very biomedical approach and so I had two surgeries with her and I called her again in probably 2021. Saying the pain is back. I've only had a surgery a few years ago. The pain is back and I dunno what to do. And her recommendation was to be on the pill, have the marina, and have another surgery.
And I wasn't really happy with that response 'cause I just, I felt so sad that I was going to have to have a surgery every five years for the rest of my life. And I couldn't believe that that was gonna be my future. And that's what brought me to. Multiple gps and then having multiple other [00:04:00] gynecologist appointment until I came to see you.
Can I ask you to just rewind? Mm-hmm. What did you feel when you first got that diagnosis of endometriosis relief? Mm-hmm. Actually, because there was a reason that I was in pain. Validation. Validation. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Especially. It was validating to be able to say to friends and family who were like, oh, well my periods are painful too.
Like, no, actually mine are worse. Even might not be true, but I just, I'd felt so much like, well, periods are painful, you've just gotta deal with that. Mm-hmm. And it was so frustrating to feel like, no, this is something more, this is something different and I shouldn't be in pain. For the rest of my life And gave you a language to communicate with other people about the severity of what you were experiencing?
Yes. Felt like that was more validating than simply being. Able to say, this is my experience. Mm-hmm. I'm feeling this pain. It's interesting, isn't it, that we could, because for many women who might have [00:05:00] Exactly. Or symptoms, they may not have the diagnosis of endometriosis or it might be normal, but they still have the same symptoms.
Yeah. And yet they have no way of, uh, often in that system of validating their experience or communicating properly with people in their lives. Because as you said, people kind of get. Oh, endometriosis. That is severe. That's a reason. But other things aren't a reason or aren't known widely that can cause pain.
Yes, and I think that kind of invalidation of women's experiences of pain generally, and that to be a woman is to be in pain and that I should expect. To be in pain. Mm-hmm. Pain rather than with the end endometriosis diagnosis. It meant that there was something wrong with me and therefore it was okay that I wasn't able to go to classes or I needed to take a break and some space all of a sudden that was allowed within my family and my friendship circles as well.
But [00:06:00] it's interesting that you're only allowed to have take time to listen to your body, to give your body what it needed. If you had had something wrong with you, if you had the diagnosis. Mm-hmm. And otherwise you weren't afforded that luxury. Yes. That's very interesting. Mm-hmm. Okay. So you had that, um, and then you had two surgeries, you said?
Yes. And you were on the verge of your third. Yes. And I guess you were thinking, well, this. Sustainable or it's not. Hmm. Yes. And around that time I started thinking, well, actually I was a child when I was diagnosed with endometriosis and very much wasn't in charge of my own healthcare. My mom, amazing support also has endometriosis.
She really led that and in her experience, her symptoms went away after she had babies. Um, she definitely wasn't encouraging me to have babies, but she thought, well, there will be an end. And I was then thinking, well, I'm an adult now. I should probably learn a bit more about this and what [00:07:00] this is actually all about.
So I started reading different. Books and articles and listening to different things, but they were all still quite biomedical. A few touched on diet changes or gentle movement and that kind of mindset of having a bit more space for yourself, but they were still very much focused on, well, the treatment is a marina, the pill surgery, and that's your options and a lot of really doom and gloom things about how, you know.
There was one story that I remember being like, well, that's terrifying of a woman who'd passed away. And during her autopsy they'd found endometriosis and her pain had been dismissed for years and years. And I thought, oh my God, am I riddled with endometriosis? Is everywhere. Is that why? Everywhere hurts.
And then I went back to the doctor. And he said, I would like an a different gynecologist. I'd go researched. I'd Googled and I found someone who I thought would be great, and I went with my partner, who is a man, and it [00:08:00] was completely dismissive. He introduced himself to my partner, not to me. Shook my partner's hand, not my hand, and then spoke to my partner throughout the entire appointment.
It was very dismissive. He also said, it's surgery. Let's book you in next week. Let's go. And then that wasn't right for me. There was a bit of time where I felt, oh, there's, there's not gonna be any option. Then I went to a fantastic GP who I felt really listened to who I am and my perspective of the world, and I said, I want something more holistic.
And she referred me to Vera. It's interesting too, isn't it, that it's not, um, it's quite a common story that although you. No one, we don't, don't wish that experience or that sequence of events.
Whether it's a health problem or whether it's something else in life, you often have to go through that kind of [00:09:00] desert or like dark night in order to say to, to re, to reclaim Really? Mm-hmm. Your, your power and say, this is a, there's gotta be a different way for me, rather than, and some people don't ever really get to that.
They do stay not questioning or thinking this is the only way it can be. So I think even in the, the feeling of I want this to be a different way and this doesn't feel right, that's an enormous area of personal growth mm-hmm. That has occurred. Mm-hmm. Um, even if you don't find the thing or like.
The courage that it takes to go on that journey. Mm-hmm. And I think that's a really important and, um, crucial part of, like, I almost think about it like heroin heroin's journey. Mm-hmm. Have you heard of that? Yeah. The hero's journey. The heroin's journey. It is likehmm. Especially for women who are, who have suffered with pain and gone through the ringer of that.
It's like that reclaiming of what do I want? Mm-hmm. Is the very [00:10:00] first part of going on that journey. Mm-hmm. For themselves, the very first start of what, uh, transformation can be possible. Yes. And it was very much, I do not want to have surgery every five years. That can't be my life. That's not living. And don't get me wrong, I was actually really nervous before my first appointment with my GP to say that I wanted a holistic approach because it was my very first appointment with her.
I didn't know what her perspective on any of this was, and I'm so grateful that she is a gp. That. Mm-hmm. In, in this sense, but in so many other ways in my healthcare as well. Mm-hmm. I'm really curious about that part too, because so many people put their health and wellness in the hands of other people.
Mm. Are wanting to go to doctors. So what was the moment for you? Because you're such an intelligent woman and you work in Allied health as well. Mm-hmm. What was it that, because that's your [00:11:00] intuition, knowing that there's another way, what was that moment where you felt that, that there is another way? And this isn't gonna be the answer for me.
Hmm. I think it, it all occurred in the context of actually studying social work at the time and learning about things and words like biomedical and acknowledging. Knowing that this approach that our country and the Western world is so reliant on is built on patriarchy and sexism, and that my experience as a woman with a women's health issue meant that I was getting a certain type of healthcare, and then I was lying on the couch one day reading this book that said.
I would need a surgery. Surgery every five years and thought, well, no. Like where did that come from? Because this book also mentioned that a lot of people don't have any reduction in pain after the surgeries. And I had my [00:12:00] experience of knowing that the pain went away for maybe a year and then came back and I thought, well, that doesn't seem like treatment to me.
And that was the real, the, the turning point to be like, no, I think I'm ready for something different. And you also probably have to be at a certain level of like okayness in your body, your nervous system, not be. Completely, um, overwhelmed because I think that is when people often go to their doctor and just want everything done for them because they almost, there's not the energy or the motivation or the, just can't see through the fog that they could take control of their own health and that their health is like, no one else is gonna help them, but, but them really, you know?
Yeah. Um, okay. So. When, and I think also like what you said about the PA medical word, that it's a very small piece of the puzzle. And of course as a social worker seeing that, that there are heaps of other pieces of the pie that need to be taken into consideration to really have that [00:13:00] holistic.
Sustainable treatment. Exactly, because I didn't also wanna go down a path where I was not connected to the medical world at all. I wanted to make sure that I was getting medical care and that my healthcare was being addressed, but in a way that really thought of my whole body, my whole life, rather than just my uterus in that part of my body.
Mm. So when you first came here, I guess, I guess, is it when you first came here, is that the first time you, apart from having that inkling that this, that it was a different way, was that the first time that you had experienced healthcare in a different way? And if so, what were the things that, or the realizations that you, you might have had after those first few appointments?
How is different? Yeah, it was my first experience of a different kind of healthcare. I'd had my family GP that I'd gone to from the age of two [00:14:00] and that gynecologist, and then a few, you know, dentists and things like that. And I think the first thing that was different was. The huge survey I had to fill out before my first appointment.
Sorry about that. I remember thinking, well, what is this for? And I had this little thought in the back of my head, well, I'm gonna get there. And they weren't Reddit, and it'll just be like, oh, done. I'll just work for no reason. And I got to the appointment and you'd read it and you had questions for me.
And that was my first moment of, oh, like, oh, she's actually prepared. For this appointment rather than feeling like I've really prepared for it because I, I felt like I'd done a lot of preparation and then turning up and feeling that I had to carry it. I had, that was a completely different experience for me, and I think the biggest thing that I noticed actually [00:15:00] was that.
There was all the, the talk on the website and I was really excited to come here, and then I got here and the walk had been walked. The space was safe, it was grounding. It really spoke to my nervous system, and I was anxious for that first appointment. But the space immediately settled me at least a little bit before I walked into that first appointment with you.
There were many other things. I'm trying to remember. I remember crying a lot in that first appointment. I'm a big crier, but I think the other huge difference was along with the, the survey, it followed in, in the appointment. It wasn't just about a. What my symptoms were. It was a really holistic, okay, who am I as a person?
Who was I as a child? How do I relate to that child? And where do I wanna go [00:16:00] from here rather than 15 minutes? This is your symptoms and this is the treatment. So did you make any connections about what. Things might have been contributing to your pain and your experience. That wasn't just the endometriosis.
Yes. If so, what were they things? Yes, yes, I did. We, we spoke at quite a length about childhood experiences. Anything from, like, one example was I had a really horrific UTI when I was younger, and then those symptoms would come back when I was. Stressed and it was you acknowledging, well, yes, those were U UTI I symptoms, but really it was that pelvic floor tightening when I'm stressed and anxious as a child, which I couldn't really understand.
Mm-hmm. And that was well before I started my periods. And then you linked those experiences of [00:17:00] stress and pain to stress and pain experienced. Around my periods. Mm. Like you're sensitized. Like you, yeah. Sensitized before the period came onto this. Yes. Yeah. And you spoke to me about the inflammation that happens naturally.
Mm-hmm. During now when we're menstruating and. The relationship that my mind has with that heart of my body to say any negative experiences, any kind of pain, any pressure, any inflammation will make those muscles go, oh no, we're in danger, and tighten up. That was the, the learning that probably had the most on my understanding of my pain and.
Of treatment options and to my healthcare through Vera, but everywhere else as well, understanding and having some [00:18:00] grace with my pelvic floor that it was trying to protect me, but it didn't need to anymore, and it could relax and it could be, uh, it didn't have to be on guard all the time. That was completely new information for me.
Apart from just learning that verbally. Mm-hmm. I would've sent.
Feeling into your body, becoming aware of when symptoms showed up, what they were trying to communicate to you about. Mm-hmm. Your nervous system, like what were the things that really moved the needle mm-hmm. That regard, other than just that understanding, which is huge and we know research tells us that just understanding the way pain works can have a really, can reduce pain and have a positive effect.
But what we [00:19:00] found is that that's generally not. Totally enough. It's about how and, um, linking it to our nervous system and having that understanding both intellectually, but really importantly from the body actually feeling, um, feeling that, that, you know, so what happened with Paula and what are the things that you did?
Yes. Well, my first appointment with Paula was after I had a marina in session with you. Mm-hmm. I think I actually found that really useful because I think my approach to my pelvic muscles and that area of my body was to ignore it unless it was in pain, and then when I was in pain to try and numb that pain in whatever way that I could, and there was no nuance in understanding.
Where the pain was coming from or why it might be coming from that space. And actually learning with you about the multiple different muscles that I [00:20:00] have in my pelvic floor. I didn't know that. I didn't know any of that. Um, that was really useful. And your first, um, exercise you did with me was I was in a supported child's post and I was breathing into my pelvic floor.
You had this visualization with a golden light that would grow and expand as I breathed in. I had to check what happens as I breathe in, but that it didn't stop at the edges of my pelvic floor, that it kept going throughout my whole body, and that when I let my breath go, that that light would still be expanding.
And that sense of stretch was. Very powerful. It hurt, but in that beautiful stretch way rather than that panicked, heightened way. And there was this moment of, oh my God, there [00:21:00] are muscles around my uterus, there are muscles around my diaphragm. There's actually a way to get to these things. And it was really interesting for me feeling in that stretch.
I could sense and feel where, oh. That's where I get really stabbing pain when I've got my period. Wow. I can stretch that. I can do something about that. I can get to that. And then you gave me one of the most painful massages of my life. And again, I thought, oh, there's a muscle there. Like really that mind body connection to those really deep internal muscles that we often don't feel unless they're in pain.
Mm. And that wasn't your pelvic floors. It that was. Through your belly to your solace? Yes, yes. Sure. Yeah. Just to point out that it's not always going straight internally to the pelvic floor. Yes. Yeah. And because I was explaining to you that I often get more pain on the left side and. [00:22:00] I had just assumed that was cramping and then it was you.
Yeah. Explaining that's a different part of my body and how that's connected to my leg. And then me thinking, oh, that's why my hip flexes are always really tight. You know? Now we've gotten to a point where my hip flexes are nice and loose, but they're really weak and that's one of the reasons why I'm in pain.
'cause I would avoid exercising, especially those muscles. 'cause I thought anything that them would cause pain. Anything that would, um. I would cause pain. And so I avoided all that kind of exercise. And was that the first time you feel like you'd actually connected with that part of your body? Yes. What did that feel like?
It was very emotional. Like it was actually not the very emotional day. I cried a lot that day too. I think that's a theme of my appointments here. Mm-hmm. That's, I have a tissue. Very important, very important. Um. It [00:23:00] was, it was emotional, but it was also really empowering to know that that like I actually had some control over this.
That endometriosis or my pelvic pain wasn't just this thing external to me that I couldn't do anything about. And I think that ped really well with that knowledge and education around the hypersensitivity and the link between my. Nervous system and pain. It was really great to have those two things happening almost simultaneously.
You know, I'd had the initial appointment with you and I think with within the month I was having the reinsertion of my marina, and then that same day, the appointment with you. To have that knowledge reinforced in multiple different ways quite quickly was really useful. And then fairly quickly after that, I think he came to a retreat, which we called missing pieces.
Mm-hmm. [00:24:00] Which was the beginning of us, um, putting together our healing pelvic pain program, which is now what we run. Mm. Do you wanna tell us a little bit about, that was a very big day for you as well. More tears? Yes. Yeah, more tears. Mm-hmm. Um, shockingly, that was a really amazing day. I think firstly, being surrounded by so many women.
It wasn't just me, it was me and maybe six other women, five other women, um, and yourself. And number one, taking the step to take a whole day off work and come out here to spend a whole day out here and really just prioritize me and this journey that I was on. Was really powerful and really important to me.
I, I'm not usually one to just take a day off work because I wanna go do something nice. So that was really exciting. And I think by that time, [00:25:00] the reproductive health leave had come into place and I was really excited to use that and know that I'm not taking away from my own sick leave and that I'm gonna be stressed if I get a cold or something.
But that day started. So beautifully and really supported and in a way that we could connect with each other as women without feeling uncomfortable. Starting outside with some beautiful breath work, I think was the perfect way to do that and get to know each other without saying, oh, how are you? What do you do for work?
And those kind of surface level things. We did so many different tasks that day that again, really connected knowledge and spirituality and the mind with the body, and solidifying that relationship. Was really useful. I, I left that day not only feeling exhausted and relaxed, but I left feeling [00:26:00] like I knew not only more about this world, but about me and who I am, but also about other women's experiences, which was really beautiful, that community that we created that day.
And I think the variety of that day was. The key to it because you did have five or six women who've got different experiences and were there for different reasons and giving us all something that we could connect to. And I think every single woman in that room had a moment, had a big cry, had a um, a reflection.
Or a breakthrough on some kind of mental block or physical block that they had in their body. The key moment for me was down in your witchy circle, which is outside this beautiful circle, this space for, I think it's a multipurpose space. You could do lots of different things there, but we were there to get some anger out and [00:27:00] to do, what did you call it?
Do you remember? Raging. Raging. Raging. And you played some ragy kind of music. And we all closed our eyes and we all danced very aggressively to this music. And I originally thought, this is so stupid. I feel ridiculous. This is so embarrassing. You know, it was peeking through my eyes. What are other people doing?
Am doing the right thing. Um. And then it was probably the most powerful exercise of the day for me. I finished fully crying and I, it really was that I'm allowed to be angry. And again, women are so often told, you're not allowed to be angry and you need to calm down, and you need to hold that in, and you need to be compassionate and empathetic.
And my whole job is being those things and not getting angry about things. And in my family. It's, I'm the youngest of six. You know, you're not supposed to be annoying or [00:28:00] make things a big deal. Just don't make things hard, don't have reactions, and to be able to like just get really angry in a physical way was really powerful.
That was probably the, the biggest moment for me. And it was a physical and emotional release. Mm. Followed by a very nice yoga session to come muscle down. Mm-hmm. To integrate it all. Yeah. Yes. So did you start to make that connection between, because there was the bit where you were like, there has to be a different way that's more holistic, but then throughout this process, did you find that connection between the symptom that you're experiencing and your, um, like your nervous system, your.
Spirit, your emotions, things that were going on in your life, things that had happened to you before, things that you were suppressing. Mm-hmm. Were you able to make that [00:29:00] connection? And how going forward were you able to listen to those symptoms and kind of decipher the meaning or learn how to, how to communicate with those symptoms or to listen as a way, as your body's way of communicating to you?
Mm-hmm. Were you able to make that. Connection. Yes, I was very much so, and there were so many moments I reflected on in my childhood and my adolescence and my early adulthood that I could see had an impact on my pelvic pain and my experiences of pain and of being a woman and, um, then having that pain in my pelvic area and that knowledge.
Reflection and tying those experiences to my pain. Also, I think validated the harm of those experiences as well. Actually thinking, oh, well, [00:30:00] actually did have an impact on me and it's valid that I'm upset and emotional and angry, or whatever I was feeling about those things because so often. Experiences of trauma are private, behind closed doors, and you're not expected to go out into the world and have any experiences or um, symptoms of that trauma, whether that's physical on the outside or physical on the inside.
And it was really powerful to be able to sit in and think, actually, no, those things did have an impact on me. But I can do something about them, and they're not my whole experience of being a person and of being a woman. So that was really useful for me. And then I think one of the things that was most useful from an internal perspective.
When coming to this holistic healthcare was to just lean in, just [00:31:00] let go and just kind of unpack and break away some of those thoughts and perspectives I had on the word holistic and what that might look like and on like woo woo things. And actually just say, well, I'm just gonna give it a go. It's not gonna do any harm, so I might as well try.
And then every time I tried it usually had a positive impact. Mm-hmm. I heard Paul speaking about. Being your own best friend. And when she sees women, she often says to them, how do you feel about her? How do you feel about your body? Mm-hmm. Your not just your body. I don't think, I think really your soul, your spirit.
Mm-hmm. Like the core of who you're, and so many women that we see. I don't have a good relationship with that her. Mm-hmm. And they either, um, there's an active dislike, there's an ignoring, there's a, putting yourself in the background to make other people comfortable. And of [00:32:00] course when you do that, you are like, not, not helping your own self to become comfortable.
It's at the expense of you. And, um, when you said I had to make these changes, which really involved listening to your body and. Scaffolding your body and giving her what she needs, um, before she starts yelling at you. Mm. And I always think that often we, we go around life and we, when we ignore, when we have that awful relationship, um.
It's like having a relationship with like a toddler. Mm-hmm. Who will scream at you if you get dysregulated. When it's dysregulated, everything gets worse. But if you are able to sit with that little person inside, you witness it, listen to it, give it what it needs, um, without overreacting. Mm um, of course you're gonna then be living in much better relationship.
Yourself and your body, and [00:33:00] then that creates so much more ease in the body because it doesn't need to shout at you all the time. Mm-hmm. Um, to listen. And I think that is so much more challenging than people think it will be that we can just change the way that we talk to ourselves. But I think often the way that that toddler that we have is often.
The way we think about her is often the way we think and experienced our childhood, I think, and that if you as a child were ignored, um, or there are certain parts about you that were not valued, then I think that relates to how you view your inner self when you're older, unless you work on that. That was my experience.
For sure in terms of feeling that having big emotions was not a good thing, and so I should push [00:34:00] that down. Asking people to make changes for you and accommodate you was not okay and was actually just disruptive and in the way and all these kind of things, so shut that down. I think that really led to the way that I was relating to her and the way that I was relating to pain.
My experiences of that was to ignore and bandaid and get angry at it for disrupting my life and getting in the way, and that was a huge bit of work I had to do to change the way that I viewed pain and myself and who I was. I have the respect and the compassion to listen to that. I also think as well, like there's, you know, although I would love more young women come at this information much earlier so that they [00:35:00] can learn more about themselves and also learn about their options so they don't feel like there's stuff being done to them.
I think sometimes. I wonder like, you know, everybody, as you said, you have to be ready for that journey and sometimes you are not ready and sometimes you know, things like the pill or turning things off so that you can survive at a time where you're not able to do that. Other work is valid. Um. I think going forward it would be really nice if everyone had the opportunity to be aware of the other options available.
Um, but also to know that if, if you are thinking, oh God, this sounds like, like a lot, um, we can often do things in small chunks, can make things easier with medication and other things while you're doing that work, we can just put it out there as something to think about. You might think I don't wanna do now come back to it.
But just being aware that there is [00:36:00] another way and that there's a way that you can be in control. Mm mm And I think putting your, the pressure on yourself to do that work when you're not ready for it, won't lead to the change that you're looking for. And you, when I the ability to do that work, I was very much in that position because of.
The support of people around me and that my workplace offered things like reproductive leave. So I could go to things like the missing pieces workshop and I could go to appointments and do that. So freely our, as we were saying, our environment can be really powerful dictator in our life. Mm-hmm. And it can take a lot of time to make your environment the right space for you to make those changes.
And that. I think, you know, when I was, um, 13 going to the doctor, I was not ready for any [00:37:00] of that because I also didn't care about any of that when I was 13, and I just felt that this pain was inhibiting my life and I wanted it to go away, and that's what I needed at that time. I'm grateful that, as well, when I was doing a lot of the, the learning about endometriosis and getting into that kind of dark head space about it and about my future.
I, I was studying, I was working at a cafe like life didn't feel like it was highly pressured, which I think actually set my brain up to be able to really think deeply about the information that I was receiving and be able to think, oh, this is not what I want. And there is, there surely has to be another way.
Yeah. You have to get to that point. Mm. I think we can get lost in the what ifs of other, you know, what if I found this earlier, but it's like you have to Yeah. Arrive at that point in readiness. Yeah, exactly. And the point is it didn't arrive earlier and there's nothing that you can do about that. [00:38:00] You can't change that.
Yes. The time it happened. Exactly. So, um, Winston, is there anything else that you would want either women who are walking the same path as you have walked or. Practitioners who deal with women who have experienced pelvic pain to know? Hmm. That's a really big question. It's, I think I would want women to know that there, there is an option out there for you that there is a way for your life to look different and that there's a way to step away from that fear and that it's your choice.
It's your journey to go on. So find a way that makes you feel empowered, and remember that this is about you. It's not about anybody else, and you don't need to consider others in this journey. That would be my biggest [00:39:00] takeaway, and what I would want women to know is really this is about you. And so often things aren't just about us, especially if we're.
As women, carers, mothers, um, work in the caring industry, this is about you and what I would want practitioners to know is that you need to make this from a start to finish thing. I don't think that my journey would've been as successful if. The practitioners I was working with didn't fully embo embody this approach from the setup of the waiting room, the trauma informed approach to pelvic exams, the trauma informed approach of the marina insertion, all the way to how you speak, how the place smells like, and then.
The knowledge and the treatment options that you are providing and the follow up and the relationship that you build, the [00:40:00] warmth that that is at Vera, you have to make that a start to finish thing. It can't just be the knowledge and the treatment. It has to be the whole package. Otherwise, it's not going to be as successful and I'd love to know.
Advice that you would give some patients because it's really inspiring to have watched you over the years because really at the end of the day, I don't think you've had that many appointments with me. I feel like I know you very well, but your commitment to doing the work as you've described, it's really hard to change and you have some kind of fire in you that has made you do it.
And I have a lot of my patients that will email me back saying. The pain's back. I'm finding this really hard. I just, I dunno if I can keep doing this. Mm. What would you say to them, because you've talked about it's, it's been having the evidence that the pain goes away over and over and over, which we know is [00:41:00] we need that consistency for neuroplastic change, but what are the things that keep you going every day to experience those?
Uh, new experiences, which is what we know creates the change. Mm. Like what is it in you that has that capacity to do that? I think it's a firm vision of what I want my future to look like, and that's easier said than done, but I would recommend that people take time to sit down. In nature, in a space, they feel comfortable and think, what do I want my daily life to look like?
What not the big goals? What do I wanna be able to do every day? And when I am super tired and the last thing I wanna do is stretch before bed, or it's really hot and we don't have air con, and oh my God, now I have to move my body. Mm-hmm. That sounds horrific. Just remind myself, well actually this will mean that I get to do what I wanna do every day and I [00:42:00] can feel the way that I wanna feel every day.
For me when the pain has come back. I think that's an interesting phrasing as well. The pain has come back as if it's come back to stay rather than I'm experiencing pain again. Yeah, it's really important and challenging yourself to change the way that you talk about pain, because I now don't really think about.
The pain is my pain. Mm. It's pain that I'm experiencing, but my, you know, you don't experience things forever. Mm. You just experience it at this time. Mm. But I think that's a lot of work and I haven't given an easy response. Mm, no, that's perfect. But that's really helpful. It's because when you're in it, people feel like, oh my God, all the thoughts that you articulated.
Well, um, and so it's not like something that you wear and it's like attached to you [00:43:00] from changeable, like all the other things. And so, um, yeah, I think your story is so inspiring. And, um, I really thank you for coming to share with us your heroine's journey today and, um, helping us.
Women and practitioners that there is another way and hopefully, hopefully enable more women to go and see more practitioners in all different places that can have, um, a more holistic view on helping men. So thank you so much. Thank, appreciate my absolute pleasure. It's an honor to be a part of this.
Thank you.
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This podcast is for information and educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment.
